Saints in a New World Order

In my first book, The New World Order and Other Secret Combinations of the Last Days (Cedar Fort, 1998), I discussed the advancing efforts of world politicians and policymakers towards creating a transnational federal union.  Despite the efforts of American conservatives and nationalists, the progression toward global governance continues, regardless which of our political parties holds power.

The progress towards a new world order was equally feted by Presidents George H.W. Bush and Bill Clinton.  In the past months since the election of President Barack Obama, especially in light of the world financial crisis, there have been calls for a new world financial order from the leaders of Russia, China, France, Italy, Germany, the United Kingdom, and even the Vatican.  Many in the world view the election of President Obama as a great step forward towards creating a single world government.  Proponents of global governance view President Obama’s positions as “post-American.”  Indeed, President Obama’s campaign speech in Berlin was praised out of the perception that he considers himself a citizen of the world first and foremost.

Latter-day saints have long expected that a time would come when America’s Constitution would “hang as by a thread.”  Our prophets and apostles have foreseen the collapse of the Republic and a period of time when the nation would have no functioning central government and civil wars would rage. LDS apostle Orson Pratt, predicted:

“What! this great and powerful nation of ours to be divided one part against the other and many hundreds of thousands of souls to be destroyed by civil wars!” Not a word of it would they believe. They do not believe what is still in the future…The time will come when there will be no safety in carrying on the peaceable pursuits of farming or agriculture. But these will be neglected, and the people will think themselves well off if they can flee from city to city, from town to town and escape with their lives. Thus will the Lord visit the people, if they will not repent.” (Orson Pratt, Journal of Discourses 12:344)

It will fall upon the latter-day saints to preserve the constitutional system of God-given rights in those communities where we are sufficiently numerous and organized to do so.  Nevertheless, American latter-day saints are extremely patriotic.  It is sorrowful and fearsome to consider that the nation we love should fall into anarchy because of the influence of secret combinations and the corruptions that permit them to exist and operate.  It might well be that the territory of the current-day United States will fall under the administration of the United Nations or a global government of some kind.

With that in mind, I would like to summarize briefly some of the considerations I developed in more detail in my book.  What would happen to the global Church in the world in a time when America’s political hegemony may no longer exist.  What happens to the Church in a new world order?  To do that, let’s consider a few scriptural vignettes.

Joseph under Pharaoh

Genesis relates the account of Joseph, son of Jacob, was sold into bondage by his brothers.  Joseph ended up as a slave in Egypt.  His diligence and natural talents let him to a series of trusted positions.  He ended up being cast into prison after falsely being accused of a sexual assault on Potiphar’s wife.  In prison, he never lost his faith and the Spirit of God was upon him.  A revelator, he was able to interpret dreams.  After many years in captivity and prison, he was brought before Pharaoh to interpret his troubling dreams.  By the power of God, he was able to interpret Pharaoh’s dreams and warn of a coming famine.  Because of his faithfulness, God used him to preserve his own family and the people of Egypt.  He never gave up.  In the midst of conditions that would cause most of us to give up and succumb to despair, Joseph stayed faithful to God.  He was delivered after much suffering and tribulation.

Esther under Ahasuerus and Haman

Esther became the queen of Persian ruler Ahasuerus.  One of the king’s noblemen, the prideful and ambitious Haman, sought to have Esther’s cousin Mordecai put to death and to have the Jews in the vast empire of Ahasuerus exterminated.  When Esther came to know of Haman’s plot, Esther put her life and her position as queen at risk by exposing it.  Esther is praised today for her bravery, courage, and her willingness to set aside her own interests for that of her fellow Jews.  Because of her humility and Mordecai’s loyalty to the king, God was able to use them to protect his covenant people. The account of Esther also relates that many people converted to Judaism because of her.

Daniel under Nebuchadnezzar

Daniel and his brethren, Shadrach, Meshach, and Abednego were part of a “reeducation program” conducted by the administration of the Babylonian King Nebuchadnezzar.  They were part of a social experiment to take Jewish youth from their families and train them to accept Babylonian customs.  It was an attempt to “de-Judaize” them.  After all, what better way to eliminate the rise of an opposition movement than to remake one’s political and military enemies into an image of oneself.  The United States did this with the Marshall Plan in Japan and Germany.  We are attempting to do it with Iraq today.

Daniel and his brothers had been well-trained by their families.  No matter what, they were able to resist the indoctrination.  In doing so, they placed their lives in God’s hands.  We know the stories of the fiery furnace and the lion’s den.  No matter what, they remained faithful, even when their lives were in danger.  Daniel rose through the ranks and became an advisor to three subsequent emperors.  He was a model of righteousness amidst intrigue and political upheaval.

Alma under the tyranny of Amulon

The Book of Mormon prophet Alma was subjected as a captive people to the whims of the tyrannical Amulon, a corrupt priest and deputy of the Lamanite king.  He forced the people of Alma into servitude and hard labor.  He forbade them to pray and to observe their religion.  Nevertheless, Alma’s people didn’t rebel, but meekly bore their burdens and cried to God in their hearts.  He gave them strength to bear their bondage and eventually delivered them to freedom by a miraculous manifestation.  The people of Alma were blessed by following their prophet.

Jesus and the apostles as subjects of the Roman Empire

Jesus Christ himself was a subject of the Roman Empire during his mortal life.  He grew up subject to its laws.  He rendered unto Caesar, that which is Caesar’s.  He did not resort to sedition or treason.  He didn’t go out and organize an armed militia group to oppose a tyrannical regime.  He was tried in the courts of Pilate and Herod for sedition only after Annas and Caiaphas had railroaded him into a charge of blasphemy.  Having not authority under Roman law to conduct an execution, they changed the charges against Jesus in order to make a case against him in the Roman legal system.  It was an example of a religion using the state to achieve its purposes.  Without authority to act in God’s name, they resorted to the state’s authority to exercise power.

After the unlawful execution of Jesus, authorized out of political expediency by Pontius Pilate, the apostles carried on the work of the kingdom.  Repeatedly, Jews who opposed the Christ’s apostles, resorted to exercising their influence with Roman authorities in order to have Christians arrested, persecuted, jailed, and tortured all throughout the empire.  The “religious right” that they represented regarded Christianity as a dangerous, heretical Jewish “cult” that twisted the scriptures to support unbelievable doctrines that involved a prophet, angelic appearances (to Zacharias, Mary, Joseph, shepherds in the fields), dreams, visions, revelations, miracles, and a founder whom they had killed. Sound familiar?

The reason I mention these scriptural examples is that we live in a world where freedom has been a rare thing.  The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints has spread across the world and has flourished in nations that have different political systems, including those we don’t think of as free.  For example, in the several decades that passed between the end of World War II and the early 1990s, members of the Church in what was the German Democratic Republic continued to live their religion, teach it to their children, and bless the lives of others.

The Church is not an American movement.  It is not a revolutionary movement.  Our scriptures teach that we “believe in being subject to kings, presidents, rulers, and magistrates, in obeying, honoring, and sustaining the law” in whatever nation we abide.  (12th Article of Faith) Some of our missionaries in Guyana recently fell into error by not properly maintaining their immigration documents as required by the law.  There may have been some political motives in the arrest and threatened deportation of our missionaries, but in the end, it was the failure of the individuals involved to obey the law that was at the heart of the problem.  If we do not obey the laws of the land, Satan will use the opportunity to stall or deter the work of God we hope to accomplish.

Section 134 of the Doctrine and Covenants tells us the will of the Lord regarding the members of the Church vis à vis the governments under which they live.  Addressing the subject of sedition, Section 134 contains two clauses which state:

“We believe that all men are bound to sustain and uphold the respective governments in which they reside, while protected in their inherent and inalienable rights by the laws of such governments; and that sedition and rebellion are unbecoming every citizen thus protected, and should be punished accordingly; and that all governments have a right to enact such laws as in their own judgments are best calculated to secure the public interest; at the same time, however, holding sacred the freedom of conscience.”

“We believe that rulers, states, and governments have a right, and are bound to enact laws for the protection of all citizens in the free exercise of their religious belief; but we do not believe that they have a right in justice to deprive citizens of this privilege, or proscribe them in their opinions, so long as a regard and reverence are shown to the laws and such religious opinions do not justify sedition nor conspiracy.” (D&C 134:5, 7)

The question arises: at what point, when constitutional civil liberties are threatened, does sedition and rebellion become justified?  Throughout this scripture on government and citizenship, there are caveats on governmental authority.  In particular, rights to “free exercise of conscience, the right and control of property, and the protection of life” are mentioned as fundamental to legitimacy. (D&C 134:2)  It is stated that no government can exist in peace unless these specific rights are respected.

Americans recognize that these principles are enshrined in our Bill of Rights and are extolled in the Declaration of Independence.  Nevertheless, latter-day saints have been in the position of having our rights trampled by mobocrats and corrupt government officials in our own nation.  Even in the most extreme conditions, where circumstances required us to resort to force of arms to defend our communities, we never renounced our citizenship or sought to overthrow the government.  Working within a constitutional framework, we appealed for redress under the law.  When the law failed to provide the sought-for compensation and restoration of our properties, we left judgment in the Lord’s hands.

American latter-day saints may one day see a government that, like the Pharaoh who “knew not Joseph,” forgets the righteous and mighty acts of godly patriots and the beneficent hand of Providence.  The scriptures speak of a time when a power or a government that will arise that is characterized as a “mouth speaking great things” that will make “war with the saints” and prevail for a time, until the Ancient of Days will come.  (See Daniel chapter 7)  This government or this individual will “speak great words against the most High, and shall wear out the saints of the most High, and think to change times and laws: and they shall be given into his hand until a time and times and the dividing of time.”  (Daniel 7:25) The Revelation of John tells us that the phrase, “a time and times and the dividing of a time” will be a period of 42 months.  (Revelation 13:5)

As the members of the Church faced violent attacks from anti-Mormon political parties in Illinois in the 1840s, after Joseph Smith’s assassination, they did their best to sue for peace and abide within the framework of the law.  They went to great lengths to avoid confrontation.  As their enemies burned homes and farms, destroyed crops, and stole livestock and cattle, the saints gathered into Nauvoo and prepared their exodus to the mountain valleys in the West.  They took to heart the warning an angel gave to the apostle John:

“He that leadeth into captivity shall go into captivity: he that killeth with the sword must be killed with the sword. Here is the patience and the faith of the saints.”  (Revelation 13:10)

Only when the threat of outright war was thrust upon the saints did they react defensively with armed resistance, such as during Johnston’s War in 1857.  Although the conflict was settled by negotiations, it was not without bloodshed.  Most regrettably, the paranoia and fear generated by the approach of the US Army escalated into the Mountain Meadows Massacre, which has caused decades of heartache and contrition.  The failure of a small group of saints to follow the angel’s warning to John left a stain permanently on the Church’s history.  Armed insurrection is not the way of the followers of the Prince of Peace.

If the future holds a time for the Church where direct persecution by governmental authorities occurs, how should we respond?  I believe the scriptural examples I cited above show us how we are to behave.

1.  We should keep the commandments and be faithful, even in captivity as was Joseph in Egypt.

2.  Be willing to stand up for what’s right no matter the personal cost.  Honorable service as citizens can make a way for God’s work to be established and even touch hearts and bring about conversions, as occurred with Esther and Mordecai.

3.  Train our children in the gospel when they are young.  A testimony cultivated in the home can overcome attempts by government officials to secularize and re-educate children, as did the parents of Daniel, Shadrach, Meshach, and Abednego.

4. Exercise patience and longsuffering, having confidence in God’s true prophets like the people of Alma.

5.  Stand steadfast in the face of an unholy alliance of civil government, the progressive left, and right wing sectarian religion, as did Jesus and the apostles, without giving any justification to charges of sedition or treason. Stand for truth and righteousness.  Bear witness of the truth.  Trust in God.  Follow the prophetic voice.  Listen to the still, small voice of the Spirit.

In the perilous times to come, there may be political upheavals, insurrections, riots, and widespread violence.  Don’t succumb to the pressures by so-called “patriots” to rise up against the powers that be as Paul said:

“Let every soul be subject unto the higher powers. For there is no power but of God: the powers that be are ordained of God.  Whosoever therefore resisteth the power, resisteth the ordinance of God: and they that resist shall receive to themselves  damnation. For rulers are not a terror to good works, but to the evil. Wilt thou then not be afraid of the power? do that which is good, and thou shalt have praise of the same: For he is the minister of God to thee for good. But if thou do that which is evil, be afraid; for he beareth not the sword in vain: for he is the minister of God, a revenger to execute wrath upon him that doeth evil. Wherefore ye must needs be subject, not only for wrath, but also for conscience sake.” (Romans 13:1–5)

Have faith.  Pray and work for the establishment of Zion so that, when the time comes, there will be places of safety and refuge for the political and societal storms that will rage.

About Greg West

Greg is a self-professed "opinionated blowhard," Mormon activist, author, blogger, husband, father of five, grandfather, musician, and computer geek. He is the national LDS examiner for Examiner.com. His books and blog posts are available on his website, the Society for the Prevention of Anti-Mormonism.
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12 Responses to Saints in a New World Order

  1. Bryce says:

    Excellent article. I think personal example and respectful conversations are the very best way to “fight” the evil in the world, be it oppression or societal moral collapse.

    Isn’t there also something in the Book of Mormon about the preaching of the word having more effect on the minds of the people than the sword?

  2. Greg, Enjoyed the article. However, I disagree with the conclusion that we, as Latter-day Saints, are not justified in rebelling against the powers that be when they become tyrannical. Though I do not believe the time has come for this and right now we should diligently put our efforts towards advancing the cause of liberty in the hearts of the people, I do believe that the time may come when this should be done. What about the example of the Founding Fathers? All the signers of the Declaration of Independence visited Wilford Woodruff in the temple as a testimony to the work they did. All these signers were rebels – many, especially George Washington, led the armed rebellion. Why was this testimony given to us if we are not supposed to follow it? Remember – it the signers of the Declaration of Independence that visited and not the framers of the Constitution. Both believed in the principles of liberty – however the group that we were given a testimony of was the rebels…

  3. Great article and I agree with the spirit of it entirely.

    In regard to the last post, I believe the rebellion of the Founders was justified (though it came from the people not from a small group as most subversive revolutions do).

    As far as we as LDS are concerned, we need to be governed by the direction of the Lord through His servants and that direction has been – in this dispensation at least – on of turning the other cheek even when it may have been technically just to do defend ourselves.

    There will, having said this, certainly be many dilemmas and tough decisions ahead for all who remain, or try to remain, faithful…

  4. RS says:

    The Saints should always consider passively resistance, like Sophie Scholl and the White Rose resistance in Nazi Germany, or along the lines of Gandhi and MLK. I fear as a people most LDS have a very shallow understanding of their constitutional rights, and just go along with “All is well in Zion” attitude.

    The best way to fight a corrupt government is to starve it by withdrawing support.
    LDS members should seriously consider NOT to join the military if our government continues to practice torture and pre-emptive warfare. It pained me to no end to see the Church sponsored military video after 9/11 that briefed LDS military members that we are in a death struggle with “Islam Fascism”. If LDS members do join the military, they should be encouraged to obey the oath to the Constitution over any unjust orders from their superiors to kill or torture non-combatants or prisoners.Thus we don’t have to fight evil, only ensure we are not fighting for it to win.

    As far as LDS working within the government for change. I have not been impressed with Rommey, Reid, or radio talk show host Glen Beck. Instead of changing the system, they were themselves were changed by it! Ron Paul as a non-member is more of champion of the Constitution than any LDS politician I’ve see to date–Which a sad commentary on the LDS community who have taken too much of a passive role in participating in the Government as citizens.

  5. 2bfree says:

    Apples and oranges. The US Constitution GUARANTEES our GOD GIVEN rights and is a standard that has NEVER existed before. This is the high ground and should not be given up. All of the examples given by the author from the old testament are not direct examples of our situation today. It is interesting how the author “spins” the examples as “obeying the powers that be” rather than actual courageous examples of “civil disobedience”. Captain Moroni example in the Book of Mormon is more applicable to our situation than any of the examples chosen by the author. We must stand by our “Standard of Liberty” which is the Constitution and defend it from ALL enemies both foreign and DOMESTIC and Captain Moroni did against those who were trying to overthrow his government..

  6. G. West says:

    I don’t know if the comments section allows URLs or not. This is the link to the follow-up article I wrote for Examiner.com:

    http://www.examiner.com/examiner/x-12813-LDS-Church-Examiner~y2009m9d16-The-Zion-party

  7. Greg, your “The Zion Party” article was superb; one of the best I’ve ever read. I absolutely agree with what you say. Perhaps you might have put the example of the one who looks upon property as sacred a little differently. I think our rights to property are sacred, and I think I could pull up some quotations from Church leaders to suggest the same, however I also understand that under the Law of Consecration, as administered under the United Order, those same property rights are honoured. There is no force or communalism in the things of God.

    But this is a minor point of wording. Other than that…

    Well done! Thanks for being a voice of sense in the often partisan and emotive world of politics – even among LDS!

  8. G. West says:

    Regarding Jeremy’s comment above, I feel it necessary to issue a clarification. I have heard many good saints who love the Constitution say similar things to his statement:

    “However, I disagree with the conclusion that we, as Latter-day Saints, are not justified in rebelling against the powers that be when they become tyrannical. Though I do not believe the time has come for this and right now we should diligently put our efforts towards advancing the cause of liberty in the hearts of the people, I do believe that the time may come when this should be done.”

    There is a fine line we must walk to sustain the lawful government of the land. Crossing the line will cause us to lose God’s blessings upon us. Where is that line? A few statements might help clarify where it is to be found:

    D&C 98:16 tells us to “renounce war and proclaim peace. Section 134:5 tells us that “all men are bound to sustain and uphold” their governments. That was just as valid for the saints who lived in the communist German Democratic Republic as it was for those who lived in the free Federal Republic of Germany. If the People’s Republic of China opened its doors to the preaching of the gospel in its borders, members of the Church in that nation would be obliged to “sustain and uphold” that government. We are not revolutionaries or counter-revolutionaries.

    In Section 98:4-8, the Lord told American saints that they were justified in befriending the constitutional law of the land. Section 134, verse 5 tells us that “sedition and rebellion are unbecoming every citizen thus protected.”

    One may say that, if that protection were to cease, that we would be justified in rebellion against oppression. Verse 11 of section 134 speaks to that scenario. It says that men are “justified in defending themselves, their friends, and property, and the government from the unlawful assaults and encroachments…where immediate appeal cannot be made to the laws….” The problem is that the time may come when the law will permit these encroachments. The Gadianton robbers in our government will carefully work through the law to undermine Constitutional rights.

    The most clear statement I have ever heard regarding latter-day saints and the possibility of their involvement in some sort of rebellion was given by Elder Howard W. Hunter. He said:

    “Citizens do not have the right to take the law into their own hands or exercise physical force. The sovereign laws of the state must be sustained, and persons living under those laws must obey them for the good of the whole. In this regard, the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints takes a strong position.” (Conference Report, April 1968, p. 63)

    Elder Hunter spoke for the Church in that statement. It wasn’t just his opinion.

    With these things in mind, I believe that latter-day saints will never be forced to rise up against the United States government. The government may collapse under the weight of its own corruption. When that happens, we will do all we can in Zion to preserve the God-given rights of man. That’s why “all nations will flow unto” Zion. It’s why Zion will be a “light unto the Gentiles.” It will be a place of “safety and refuge.”

    We need to be more ready to beat our swords into plowshares. Those who resort to force of arms will be slain by them. (Revelation 13:10) The Lord will defend the peaceful people of Zion by his power. They wicked will say, “Let us not go up to battle against Zion.” (D&C 45-66-70 and 1 Nephi 22:17)

    The scriptures and the words of the prophets will guide us on the path of peace and safety toward Zion and his protection if we are faithful. I don’t believe the time will ever come that the saints of God will rise up against the United States. To intimate that we ever would potentially places the Church and its members in jeopardy.

  9. Jeremy says:

    Greg, Regarding D&C 134 – you left out the followinging line. In total it reads – “We believe that all men are bound to sustain and uphold the respective governments in which they reside, while protected in their inherent and inalienable rights by the laws of such governments”. So, we are only bound to sustain these governments when we our rights are protected. If the government becomes the very organization that destroys these rights, then we are no longer bound uphold that government. The line seems pretty clear to me.

    President Ezra Taft Benson, speaking as the prophet of the church, gave a talk “The Constitution – A Heavenly Banner”. In it he talked clearly about threats to the Constitution – which are internal. At the end he stated “We, the blessed beneficiaries, face difficult days in this beloved land, “a land which is choice above all other lands” (Ether 2:10). It may also cost us blood before we are through.” He was not taliking about fighting against foreign aggressors but those who would corrupt it from within.

    Lastly, why do we as a church honor the signers of the Declaration of Indpendence if we don’t believe in following their examples?

  10. Rex says:

    I agree with RS about LDS not joining the military. The U.S. military (in which I have served) has become the legions of the Rome of the 20th and 21st centuries. Joining the U.S. military has little to do with protecting the rights of American citizens or patriotism, and everything to do with preserving and expanding the U.S. empire. In its current state, there is nothing holy or sacred about the U.S. government, especially since it hardly resembles the original intent of the Constitution and its principles.

    If the Church had been restored prior to the RevWar and there had been a Twelfth Article of Faith, “good” Church members would have been Tories and fought for King George. I’m sure, however, that some would have fought for liberty, like some of the “fighting” Quakers did, in opposition to their non-violent creed.

    It might be useful to note that, although canonized, Section 134 is not a revelation to Joseph Smith, nor any of his successors. It, and a statement on marriage (which was rejected apparently because it contradicted the plural marriage principles of Section 132), were written by other leading brethren in Joseph’s absence.

    Regarding the example of Joseph in Egypt, he practiced a form of centralized economy and redistribution, which enriched and further empowered Egypt. When the people needed food, they had to go to the government, and everytime they went, Joseph made them pay with whatever they had left, including their land. In the end, everything in Egypt belonged to Pharaoh. I’m not sure I agree with those principles. Sure, the people lived, but they ended up as slaves to Pharaoh.

    Regarding your other examples of forebearance and patience, which qualities indeed are often required, I offer the counterbalancing example of Moroni and Pahoran:

    “And it came to pass that those who were desirous that Pahoran should be dethroned from the judgment-seat were called king-men, for they were desirous that the law should be altered in a manner to overthrow the free government and to establish a king over the land. … And it came to pass that Moroni commanded that his army should go against those king-men, to pull down their pride and their nobility and level them with the earth, or they should take up arms and support the cause of liberty.” (Alma 51:5, 17)

    I have come to believe that the Church will be the last repository of constitutional principles, but those principles will be preserved within the land of Zion, while the rest of the world self-destructs. In D&C 87:6, we read:

    “And thus, with the sword and by bloodshed the inhabitants of the earth shall mourn; and with famine, and plague, and earthquake, and the thunder of heaven, and the fierce and vivid lightning also, shall the inhabitants of the earth be made to feel the wrath, and indignation, and chastening hand of an Almighty God, until the consumption decreed hath made A FULL END OF ALL NATIONS” (my emphasis).

    This scripture does not except the United States of America.

    In Section 45:67-71, regarding the establishment of Zion, we read:

    “And the glory of the Lord shall be there, and the terror of the Lord also shall be there, insomuch that the wicked will not come unto it, and it shall be called Zion. And it shall come to pass among the wicked, that EVERY MAN THAT WILL NOT TAKE HIS SWORD AGAINST HIS NEIGHBOR MUCH NEEDS FLEE UNTO ZION FOR SAFETY. And there shall be gathered unto it out of every nation under heaven; and IT SHALL BE THE ONLY PEOPLE THAT SHALL NOT BE AT WAR ONE WITH ANOTHER. And it shall be said among the wicked: Let us not go up to battle against Zion, for the inhabitants of Zion are terrible; wherefore we cannot stand. And it shall come to pass that the righteous shall be gathered out from among all nations, and shall come to Zion, singing with songs of everlasting joy” (my emphasis).

    To me, this does not sound like the Zion of today, scattered all over the world. This sounds like the Zion that will be established beginning at Independence. It seems that there might one day be another call to gather to Zion, similar to the 19th-century call to Utah. Even those among the “wicked” who refuse to engage in the violence will be accepted into Zion, where, righteous principles, including those of constitutional government, will be preserved and practiced.

    As an aside, it is instructive to note that any time Israel has been united and organized, it has had armies. One of the things that might make Zion “terrible”, in addition to the Lord’s presence, might be the armies protecting her borders.

  11. Winston says:

    :…when a long train of abuses and usurpations, pursuing invariably the same Object evinces a design to reduce them under absolute Despotism, it is their right, it is their duty, to throw off such Government, and to provide new Guards for their future security.”

    The Founding Fathers seemed pretty clear in their intentions, the sentiment hasn’t changed, what was true for them in the 1700′s is certainly true for us today.

  12. Cody H says:

    I believe we are to uphold the Church, Constitution, and the Government[as long as it upholds the Constitution]. I also beleive it is not our place to be apart of acts of destruction to uphold these things. The fight should be against wicked people, and not against people’s property. Riots, mobbing, and violence among ourselves does not do ANYTHING to bring about freedom, it only destroys ourselves, and Constitution. (A kingdom against itself cannot survive). To fight for the cause of freedom, we need only do what the prophet asks us to do. If he says flee to the wilderness, we go. If he says fight, we fight.

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